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About itsamecameron

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  1. The KLG4 and the KLDE both have oval intake runners. The only ones that are square are on the KLZE and apparently some of the the 2.5s in the Millenia have them too ^^ ..... I cant confirm this though, so my advice would be if you are gonna get a KLG4 intake manifold make sure its from a 98 or up 626 then you know for sure what you are getting. Also just an fyi the intake manifold swap is one of those "im almost out of basic things to do" mods, its not gonna be super amazing like everyone makes it out to be. Yeah it will give you a little more power, but start off basic with intake exhaust headers ect, then move to the intake manifold and IM TB spacers, and port and polish stuff. If you keep everything stock but the IM it would be a waste.... and yes I know for a fact the G4 has oval runners, Just replaced VCGs a little while ago on my G4. Oh and this is a duh but make sure you clean the inside of the IM, seafoam or carb cleaner works great.
  2. The front of the faces are indeed white, but the back of the faces has a green film on it. It might not look like it even if you do look at the back because the green is covered by a white as well lol. But sand off the white on the back of the faces and then you will find a green layer on. After you sand that off it is going to be actual white. The reason they put the white on top of the green is because it reduces the ghosting effect since there are only four bulbs that light all of the gauge faces and needles. It is like that on most cars. my 07 ford fusion had the same thing. Back of the faces looked white, but once you sanded that off there was a green layer, and well thats how I got my faces white, since the fusion uses white leds. Our cars use white bulbs with green bulb condoms, so you have to sand the back green off and replace the bulbs with a diff color or simply remove the bulb condom. I know it sounds kinda odd that they have green lights and green film but trust me it is. I did my gauge faces myself and thats how I found out. lol thats also how I found out about the little plastic nubs on the temp and fuel gauge! Now I have a half tank of gas when the car is actually empty only way to fix that one is to get a new face which sucks...
  3. Just an FYI you can remove the faces of the gauges and swap em out. its pretty easy to do you just have to rip the cluster apart, pull the needles off carefully but be especially careful on the ones for fuel and temp! there are small plastic bumps on the gauge face that make it so the needles can only go so far and if you break it they will be all out of whack. After you get the needles off you have to get the gauge faces off by breaking the small plastic welds that hold them on. they are at the corners. And while you are back there you can sand off the green overlay that is on the back of the faces that way you can change the color to any you wish. Just my $.02. that way the mileage stays accurate on the ODO
  4. Yeah things go differently depending on what region you are talking about, almost enough to drive one mad.... US vs Jap vs Euro is a whole nother kinda beast...... As far as the question about ZE cams in a G4.. I have no solid answer for ya, the main issue I can see is the fact that the G4 uses a coil pack which is fine and dandy, but the ZE uses a standard disty and has a gear on the camshafts them selves to run the disty. I have no clue what the ramifications would be, maybe you can just remove the end part of said cam (the gear is on the camshaft closest to the front of the car as far as I know)........ all I know is it goes through the metal on the motor itself to connect with the disty on the outside of the motor, not sure if there is a part that connects the two that can simply be omitted or what. I guess the best way we can figure it out is for some brave soul to try it out, if it works the gains would be good, if not well all that work to tear apart the top of the motor would be in vein. If I had ZE cams id check it out when I do my vcgs and timing belt since ill be in there any way, but they are expensive and I need to save up a good chunk of change since my car is currently missing a very important pedal, and lets face it thats number one on my list for sure.
  5. Still cant find if just the injectors will fit, but like MonoxideChild said the injectors will fit our rail so thats most likely the best option. But wow that MSD switch is a much better option!! didnt even know it existed so thanks a bunch!!!!! From what I can gather you need two of em.. one for each VRIS point... Anyone have em so we can verify that?
  6. yeah I was just talking the injectors... Seems like a dec upgrade. I've never heard of the msd switch so that's why I didn't mention it...
  7. Yeah there are differences between the manifolds. The G4 is the best flowing manifold that has an EGR valve. VRIS is a little different in the G4 but it should work with a DE just fine. I have a G4 and am just going to port it and add pheno spacers... If you have a G4 I really don't think its worth the money and time involved to get it going the "right" way. (You really should port match it so you are not going from a rectangle to an oval..) Also there IS a device that is not made anymore that allows you to adjust the VRIS points... So if you are running a mixture of parts you can do a dyno run and find the best settings to adjust... http://www.thevenom....rs/vrtuner.html It would be great if they told us how to build one, since they are not building any or selling any... I know id build one just to try it out Just in case you want to know here is what your VRIS does for you! Just so you know the time and money involved to get said parts would be quite a bit... and its well known that the KL has weak rods, so I would personally go aftermarket on the rods and pistons (which you can get in high and low compression). Stick with the block and IM that you have, ZE cams are great until you realize they are not that much less than a complete ZE... especially since you can get EVEN MORE aggressive race ground cams... The ZE is a good engine but its still stock... So improvements can be made in many places... unfortunately most of those places are the same as a DE G4... Just a swap to have the higher NA power is great, but doing a ZE swap just to replace some of the parts that make it a ZE sounds redundant to me... Here is what my ideal engine list would be KLG4 base Ported and knife edged IM Pheno spacers Ported TB Ground and knife edge throttle plate & VRIS shutters Aftermarket rods, and pistons (NA high compression, boost low compression) Race ground camshafts KLG4 ignition system Milly S fuel injection Be sure to get a good CAI, Exhaust headers, and exhaust system Good plugs and wires....
  8. That is great to hear that there are actual dyno plots! I may have to track the thread down and post a link.. So the DE has better valves and springs?? I have never heard that, but a good bit of info to add to the thread. I really want to put as much solid info I can find into the thread. There are just way too many rumors floating around about the KL series in general, so it makes it super hard to find more info that is fact! I am currently looking into the Milly motors... once I sort through all the stuff and find good solid info ill be sure to post it up. If I posted all the info ive found that was not backed or the "my buddy has a... and he says it..." stuff this thread would be much longer lol. Also just want to throw this out there, I will copy some of the info out of ur posts and update the first one.. If you don't want me to do that just let me know!! I want to keep it simple to look at and find the info instead of going through many posts for one tid bit of info. I DONT want to take credit for any of the info, since its not my info to start with, I am just tryin to sort it out and arrange it in one place. Thanks for all the added info guys, and keep it coming!
  9. yup the two a spec motor specs where verified via http://www.internetautoguide.com/index.html it's a good un bias souce for that info
  10. Ah I completely forgot about the Millenia!! Well now I have another bit of searching to do. Not sure why but whenever I think of the Millenia I always think of the 2.3 Miller cycle.... love the way that motor sounds! Speaking of the Millenia S im pretty sure we can use the fuel rails off of em... Could be a cheap injector upgrade if one was at a junk yard. Oh and I updated the info, thanks for the help
  11. KLDE vs KLG4 vs KLZE Hi all new to the forums but have been doing research for quite a while. I have learned quite a bit through the various forums such as www.mx6.com www.probetalk.com and this very site. I would like to thank anyone that posts more info to this thread!! I will update all info to this first post to keep things simple to find. I have noticed a general trend that many of us are confused about our motors and what differences there are from year to year, j-spec ect. (I know I was!!) My goal here is to list basic specs for the three KL variations, differences between each one, and clear up common misconceptions in regards to compatibility and benefits of parts between the three. I have found all the information from the above sites and credit should be given to the above forums and their members. That includes members of this forum that add to the thread!! If any corrections or additions need to be made go ahead and let me know! I love to have accurate info and am happy to hear what others have to say. First off there are three main variations of the KL series motors that we will be working with... the KLDE, KLG4, and KLZE respectively. They are all 2.5L DOHC V-6 with 4 valves per cylinder, and where available in the Mazda 626, Mazda MX-6, Ford Probe, and other cars not sold in the U.S. The KL series was available in 1993 all the way up to 2002 in the U.S. The KL series lived longer outside the states, when/if production quit I am not sure. KLDE (1993-1997) U.S. 164 horse power with 156 ft/lb torque Compression ratio of 9.2:1 84.5 mm bore, 74.2 mm stroke Uses OBD-I through 1995 1996-1997 OBD-II 220cc Fuel injectors If you have a stock 1993-1997 Probe GT, 626 V6, or an MX-6 V6 you have a KLDE. A common upgrade is to swap the stock intake manifold with a KLZE manifold. The DE manifold has oval intake runners while the ZE has square runners, so port matching is a must for best results. Also the ZE has no place for an EGR valve so if you live in a state with emissions testing or are annoyed by the CEL being on constantly this may not be the route for you. A good alternative would be to get a KLG4 manifold to swap. With proper porting and knife edging the gains will be about the same, but the runners are the same shape and it has an EGR valve. This makes it a simple swap. The DE uses a VAF which can be very restrictive compared to a MAF The KLDE uses a distributor cap. This has its ups and downs, but be aware that the distributor is driven by a gear with the cam shaft, so any swaps will need to have this gear. The cam shafts use whats called a Hydraulic Lash Adjuster or HLA for short. The HLA can cause many headaches with the car so be aware if you hear em tapping. The DE uses OBD-I and has some ECU upgrade options. Generally a KLDE will put out less power than a KLZE running similar components with the same amount of boost From what I can gather the recommended boost pressure is about 6psi, although I have heard of a daily driver pushing 15psi for about 7 months on stock internals. The KLDE uses better stock retainers than a KLZE KLG4 (1998-2002) U.S. 170 horse power with 163 ft/lb torque Compression ratio of 9.5:1 84.6 mm bore, 74.2 mm stroke Uses OBD-II 220cc Injectors If you have a stock 1998-2002 626 then you have the KLG4. People commonly mistake this motor for the KLDE, while there are many similarities there are also many differences. The KLG4 is the last revision in the KL series. Many issues that plague the DE are resolved by the G4. Power wise it is in between the KLDE and KLZE. The KLG4 was introduced in 1998 so needless to say you won't find a stock MX-6 or Probe with one in it. The G4 uses an electronic coil pack system instead of a distributor cap. The G4 uses better solid lifters as opposed to the HLA system in previous models. The G4 uses a MAF sensor for better intake flow and more accurate readings. The KLG4 has the lightest crank out of the three variations (I believe about 7 lbs lighter) this reduces rotating mass...its a good thing. The G4 is OBD-II only Most parts/upgrades for the KLDE will bolt right up to the KLG4 The power band of the G4 is shifted slightly to the right compared to the DE As far as I can find the ECU in the G4 is un-tweakable... The KLG4 can handle boost with stock internals best out of the three variations (according to members on the forums anyway) , that is it will be least likely to be damaged due to boost when compared to a DE or ZE with the same pressure under the same conditions...think apples to apples.. KLZE (J-Spec) I want to start off by saying that there is a lack of concrete information in regards to the KLZE. With that in mind I will present the info that I have found... The KLZE is said to have anywhere from 190 horse power all the way up to just over 200 horse power. Torque is in the area of 165+ ft/lbs Uses more aggressive cams that allow for longer lift durations. Has a compression ratio of 10.0:1 Can be put into any V6 626 with little modification (as long as you use all of your current sensors and ECU) Said to be best bang for buck when power is concerned Has NO EGR valve so to prevent a CEL the EGR should be left plugged in to vacuum lines and electrical connection... Mods to first generation DE ECUs can be made to take further advantage of the cams There are two variants available, a straight neck and a curved neck. (Straight neck is usually more spendy but better, curved necks are often used in MX-3s due to smaller engine bay) There are curved neck ZEs that have standard compression pistons, and standard compression cams! So be sure to get a look at the stamp on the cams if you are considering a ZE. Thanks to MonoxideChild for the info on that! They will produce more power with lower amounts of boost due to the higher compression ratio ( this also makes them run a higher risk of internal damage) An after market air intake should be used since the stock DE and G4 intake box will mount up properly. (Not sure if this is fact or fiction since I have not had a ZE) In a nutshell the extra power comes from higher compression pistons, different intake manifold, and more aggressive cam shafts. KLZE uses the same 220cc fuel injectors as the DE and G4 Interchangeable parts between the three (Make your own KL hybrid variation!) Intake manifold (use the best one for your application) Transmissions (any KL, KF, K8, and KJ use the same bell housing! ) The block Rods pistons bearings ect... Injectors (Millenia S or JE injectors are a good upgrade @ 280cc and a direct fit) Some fuzzy areas that I need help clearing up: I don't know is weather the ZE or the G4 intake manifold flows better. Seems like everyone has their own opinion with no info to back it.... I have come to the general understanding that either will flow better than the stock DE IM... so if you have any info on this lets hear it!! I know the DE and G4 are non-interference motors. I would assume that the ZE IS an interference motor due to the flat top pistons.... but im not sure. I can't seem to find if removing/bypassing the EGR valve will result in a power gain or not.... I know it can be done, and there are work arounds for the CEL but I just can't see why people are doing it... From what ive read, the DE and ZE use distributors and are driven by a cam gear... so that would lead me to believe that you cant swap cams from a DE/ZE into a G4 and vice versa Thats all I can think of right now, but if anyone has additions feel free to post em up!
  12. yeah that makes sense. The crack in the gasket was bad enough but when the rod bent it sounded bad and that was the end of the motor. I'm sure the over heating didn't help lol
  13. I do know for a fact that the weak part in the kl is the rods... and if you push it too hard or get it too hot they will bend. Hopefully that didnt happen to you, but from the noises you described it very well could have. At that point its usually cheaper to buy a used engine than to rebuild it. Happened to me with the 626 I had before the one I have now! (head gasket cracked so overheated and rod bent) In general the two worst things you can do when your car is overheating is keep driving it, OR shutting it off. Keep driving it and it keeps making heat. Shut the car off and the cooling system stops circulating and doing its job. Not sure if leaving it running would have helped you since you apparently had no fluid in the cooling system but if it ever happens again id strongly recommend that you pull off the road and let the car sit running so the cooling system can cool the motor down. I really hope nothing bad happened to your motor good luck!
  14. Hi all I just bought a used 98 626 LX V6 with an atx. About four years ago I had an ES V6 with a manual and I really miss it! Does anyone know how much it would cost to do a swap? any info on where I could get the parts/kit would be great! Also any idea how much it should cost to get the swap done? I do have friends with way modded subies (only thing stock is the block) and they do all their own work so im sure I could get one of them to help me out if its a ton of $$ Any help is greatly appreciated!
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